Travis Seitler

Early Church Meetings [Quotes Week]

“They asserted, however, that the sum and substance of their fault or error had been that they were accustomed to meet on a fixed day before dawn and sing responsively a hymn to Christ as to a god, and to bind themselves by oath, not to some crime, but not to commit fraud, theft, or adultery, not falsify their trust, nor to refuse to return a trust when called upon to do so. When this was over, it was their custom to depart and to assemble again to partake of food–but ordinary and innocent food. Even this, they affirmed, they had ceased to do after my edict by which, in accordance with your instructions, I had forbidden political associations.” — Pliny the Younger

In more sixpencey words, “Sing a song to Jesus | and promise not to lie | then get together in a home | and eat some fresh-baked pie.” Sounds… simple, doesn’t it? Why doesn’t this sound anything like most Christians’ (in the Western world, at least) Sunday gatherings? Head on over to Alan Knox’s post on it to chime in on that particular discussion.

Sovereign Grace Ministries - Church or Cult? [Quotes Week]

I want to kick off “quotes week” on a serious note, but the Monkey song was just too darned funny. Anyway, here’s my original Monday post:

“…how is it that CJ Mahaney can make 5 references to his pride and arrogance in his blog, [and] that’s somehow celebrated as humility… [but Larry Tomczak] is confronted with observations of pride and arrogance, prayerfully considers these observations, repents of his sin, writes a letter to this effect that is distributed to the entire ministry, steps down from leadership, and submits to months of disciplinary consequences… [only to be considered] ‘disqualified’ to lead a church?

“I’m sorry. But this woman’s posts—more than any others (b/c she was obviously involved in this process)—has convinced me that Sovereign Grace is a cult.”

(comment by “SGM Casualty” on SGM Survivors)

This website is blowing the lid off of the corruption and poor leadership that’s been allowed to fester in Sovereign Grace Ministries, due to years of fear, control, and cultic tactics. It’s heartbreaking to hear some of the stories from former members; moreso to hear the ensuing silence from SGM leadership.

There’s nasty stuff in there, folks, but C.J. et al seem to want to just circle the wagons. Honestly? I think that’s worse than anything that’s being said over on the blog (and new message board).

“Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them.“ — Ephesians 5:11 (ESV)

UPDATE: On Friday, March 14th, Eric Simmons spoke to the singles at Covenant Life Church in Gaithersburg, MD. You can download the MP3 of his talk, but what I find most interesting is this particular quote (beginning at the 13:49 mark):

I’m also concerned because at this point in time, we are at the pinnacle of the Information Age. You can in an instant find tons of information on any subject you want on Google. Do you realize that Google allows you to be one step away from a lot of heresies?

There are a lot of heretics out there with a lot of false teachings that have blogs. And it’s phenomenal to me in our age now, that what is represented on the Internet is now seen as fact, and authority, and truth! And the reality? Most of these guys who are writing blogs are 24-year-old guys living in their moms’ basement, sitting there in their underwear! That’s what they’re doing! They’ve got a robe on, and they’re just typing away. And they’re typing away their false teaching, which is honestly a bunch of garbage.

It’s out there! It’s just one click away.

I would humbly submit that this is nothing more than fear-based propaganda. (I would also like to point out that C.J. Mahaney, Josh Harris and Eric Simmons are all bloggers–Eric doubly so, as he also writes for the New Attitude blog.)

UPDATE #2: I seem to have driven the “Orthodoxy Underground” further underground, as can be attested by Google’s cached versions of these Blogger profiles. (Thanks to Elaine Hooton for pointing out that the blog was apparently taken down.) I don’t know much of anything about the blog (it was private; you had to be pre-approved by their admins just to read it), but apparently (according to Google) Thabiti Anyabwile, Justin Buzzard and Ricky Alcantar were all members of the blog. So why’d they delete the whole thing, just a few days after this matter came up?

UPDATE #3: Bugger. The Google Cache link doesn’t work anymore. Well, it just listed the Blogger profiles for Eric, Thabiti, Justin and Ricky (and showed them as linked to the Orthodoxy Underground site). Thanks to Dan for catching this one!

UPDATE #4: What do I mean by “cult”? Find out here.