Don’t you know our pastor has authority over you?
“Pastoral authority” is invoked in support of all kinds of actions, events, and propositions. In more mundane uses, “pastoral authority” becomes a catchphrase signaling the need to acquire permission from the pastor to take action or make a public statement. Along these lines, you might hear someone say, “I disagree with Pastor Tom about this issue, but I don’t want to undermine his pastoral authority.” More extreme applications, of course, include the forceful silencing of dissent and the legitimization of unfortunate personality worship. In this vein, something like this is more likely: “Don’t you know our pastor has authority over you?”
To be clear, in my criticism I do not take away from the responsibility of our local church pastors to shepherd our congregations. The apostles left us careful instructions regarding the need for us to recognize, honor, imitate, and submit to our leaders (1 Thess 5:12-13; 1 Tim 5:17; Heb 13:7, 17), as well as details regarding the characteristics that qualify and disqualify leaders from service (1 Tim 3:1-7; Titus 1:5-9).
Yet, if you survey the teaching of the NT epistles on the matter of elders, overseers, leaders, or shepherds, you will find no mention of “authority” or “exercising authority over” anyone. In fact, 1 Peter 5:3 contains explicit instruction for shepherds to oversee the people “not lording it over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock.”
Source: SBCOutpost.com (HT: Alan Knox)
August 2nd, 2007 at 7:10 pm
Very interesting…I tend to agree!
August 7th, 2007 at 8:19 pm
This is interesting and very true. As pastors, we must be sure that we use our authority in the proper manner. My husband and I find that pastors go through phases where they have earned trust and are therefore allowed more freedom in decisions and such. During the low times, we must work to make up the deficit in our “accounts”.
Your post makes me wonder what prompted your post.
I hope all is well with your church!
August 15th, 2007 at 10:56 am
Your angst is very obvious and eloquent. Nevertheless, Travis, I think you are trying to stir dissent. The very fact that you gave sandwiched one paragraph about honor between two that clearly show you are upset, discouraged, proud, and jealous that your personality is not worshipped, beds the question, “Are you are more about pointing out faults of others or dealing with your differences privately?” I will be the first to agree there are popular people and unpopular people in our church, but you will have this ANYWHERE. But they are usually the ones serving more than griping.
August 16th, 2007 at 11:09 am
Zoanna, this is a quote from another blog. I didn’t write it. =/
“…clearly show you are …jealous that your personality is not worshipped…”
I don’t remember talking to you in private about any of this, so really, who does this sentence really apply to: “Are you are more about pointing out faults of others or dealing with your differences privately?” If you think I’m doing something wrong here, you’re certainly not showing it by your comments.
August 16th, 2007 at 4:51 pm
I apologize. Please forgive me. I didn’t realize you were quoting someone else.That was sloppy reading on my part. If I am reading it right, however, it looks like you wrote the second and last paragrahs. Did you write from “to be clear…” to “examples to the flock.” ?
Regardless, the fact that you quoted it without giving a convincing argument against at least it didn’t convince me) makes me think you agree very much with it. AM I wrong?
August 16th, 2007 at 5:31 pm
Nope, the only thing I contributed was “Source: SBCOutpost.com (HT: Alan Knox).”
I really wish people would read the posts I pull quotes from (and not just the snippets I include)! The whole reason I do that is to point out what I think are thought-provoking posts in other blogs. If you’d read it, then you would have realized what I did and didn’t write, and you would have had a better idea where that author was coming from and why she wrote what she did.
Still… I can’t figure out where the “jealous that your personality is not worshipped” comment came from. It sorta blind-sided me; I was thinking, “what from that quote–assuming, as Zo does, that I wrote it myself–would have given that particular impression?” Because honestly… if you think I agree with the quotes I’ve been putting up, then isn’t worshipping any personality kinda on the other side of the universe from what “I’m” advocating?
For the record: I don’t always agree with what I quote here, but I do always think it’s something worth thinking about.
And well, I do agree with this particular quote. But I fail to detect any angst, discouragement, pride or jealousy in it. Maybe I’m not good at reading intentions… or maybe I’m just not as judgmental as those people who love to judge my heart claim?
August 16th, 2007 at 5:37 pm
Actually, let me amend that last comment a bit: of course y’all don’t have to read the articles I link to… but I sure wish y’all would at least read them first if you intend to comment.
August 16th, 2007 at 8:01 pm
I did not understand all of that was a quote. Silly me! I enjoyed reading that article, just now, though. I must refrain from addressing women in ministry, as well, considering that I am a woman in ministry and feel called by God to be such. And I still cannot see where that whole dissent idea came from but then I don’t attend your church either. Am I right that you both attend the same church? Anyway, it was a good read. Thanks, Travis.
August 17th, 2007 at 1:33 pm
Yeah, what’s the deal, Elaine? You’re supposed to remain silent, right?
Yup.
August 17th, 2007 at 2:40 pm
Yeah! Just try to make me! I dare you!
August 17th, 2007 at 3:34 pm
Funny. The first thing that clued me that this was a pull-quote were the cute little quotemark icons at the top of the text. The second thing that clued in were the additional textual doublequotes at the beginning and then at the end of the sectin. You know, the funny little “” marks? The third clue was the Source, and the fourth clue was the “Hat Tip.”
That Travis didn’t articulate where he stands on the issue made it clear he was posting it for dialog and thought.
That he got attacked right out of the gate is really no surprise. For those who fully beileve in the pastor’s authority over all things ecclessiastical, any questioning of authority at all is tantamount to heresy. There had to be someone out there who would get twigged by this.
:: sigh ::
And this merely illustrates his point.
Rich
BlogRodent
August 17th, 2007 at 5:30 pm
I wrote the comment on THIS post after reading several of your “thought-provoking” other ones. Somewhere in one of your others was the line “unfortunate personality worship” . I have scrolled back to try to find it and can’t. YOu don’t know me very well; I question EVERYTHING. I do not readily swallow every teaching without chewing on it. But I also know that in my so-called questioning is my own proud heart wanting to be right, say it well, and close the book on disagreement. I would just urge you and anyone else to live six months in the shoes of a pastor and then see if you’re so quick to pull quotes off the internet instead of using your own words. I am not wild about people quoting other people ad nauseum, either. I don’t like it in blogland, the pulpit, in books, or wherever. Good for you if you do, but I am not fond of quoteville, esp if you don’t voice whether you agree or disagree with said quote. Posting a quote, in my mind, tells readers you probably DO agree with it. If you do, say so. If you don’t, do you like to provoke thoughts or just provoke? Or is it a way of hiding? I’m just asking. I mean, if you don’t come right out and say it, you can’t be held “accountable,” right?
August 17th, 2007 at 6:03 pm
So you read this:
And come away with “Travis just wants his own personality worshipped” instead of the actual meaning of the statement: “in these cases, congregations are making idols our of their pastors”?
Zo.
#1. Please calm down. (Maybe you are calm, but typing in caps represents yelling. So if you are calm, try to write more like you are.)
#2. This is my “web log.” Log, as in journal or diary. Do I have readers? Sure. Do I put things here primarily for other people? Sometimes. But you know what? Sometimes I put something here just because I don’t want to forget it later. The internet’s pretty big, and it’s really easy for a blog post to get lost out there. (And I’m scatterbrained enough as it is!) Posting a quote simply means I don’t want to lose that quote.
#3. This is my “web log.” If you’re not fond of “quoteville,” well… so what? Are you now dictating to other people what they can and can’t write in their own journals, simply because you don’t prefer it?
#4. Six months in a pastor’s shoes? Looks like I’m getting a good feel for that, except, oh! Pastors worry about getting talked about behind their backs. I get slapped in the face in my own “home.”
Go ahead, accuse me of a few other things. You’re on a roll. =)